Home > Scientology philosophy, Thoughts > On the fear of the the unknown

On the fear of the the unknown

Being in the gay corner today (no not the homosexual one), I would like to bring to your attention a rather nice video illuminating the fear of the unknown:

The video contains a lot beyond the fear of the unknown, though – such as fixed ideas, daring to look, daring to act upon what one sees, challenging reality and the possibility of something being outside our realm of existence.

It may serve as a sort of parallel to the Theta-MEST theory, except theta is not contained in another dimension; and that makes it so much harder for some to accept.

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  1. Hubbardianen
    2009-11-03 at 14:43

    Funny and entertaining!

  2. 2009-11-03 at 14:53

    Only someone who believes in duality would have a hard time accepting that.

    Non-dualists find it very easy to accept.

    Actually, non-dualists find it very easy to accept anything.

    Have you ever heard of 4-Valued Logic and the 2nd century Buddhist philosopher named Nagarjuna? One finds that “Theta/MEST” theory is quite a dualism, and one needs more to rise up out of it.

    Non-dualism, as expressed in the concept of “emptiness”, and “no-self” by Nagarjuna leads the way.

    Here’s more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagarjuna#Philosophy

    It also works nicely with multi-dimensional Quantum and String theories.

    I have also found that it helps resolve the problem of mortality.

  3. Cinnamon
    2009-11-03 at 14:57

    Regarding flat-land, I never went much for that analogy.

    But I do sense some sort of relationship, between their world, and that of the ever-rising stat graphs.

    • 2009-11-03 at 15:14

      It comes from Quantum and String Theories in physics.

      Here’s a very good description of the 10 Dimensions that might make up this universe.

      Enjoy.

    • Chris
      2009-11-04 at 05:37

      Indeed,and this inexplicable published book in the Victorian era 😉

  4. As-Is
    2009-11-03 at 15:42

    Yes it’s a nice story that illustrates the issues you mention. There’s also this short film which I found entertaining: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=C8oiwnNlyE4

    I have found that probably the most zealous and “religious” people are now materialists going on missions to disprove all other opinions and beliefs, ignoring evidence contrary to their beliefs. This is quite an amusing example of Richard Dawkins being one such character:
    http://www.sheldrake.org/D&C/controversies/Dawkins.html

    The funny thing is that evolution of the body and genetic entity exists, but people like darwkins worry that if spirit also exists then it disproves genetic evolution. There is both: theta and mest. Both have a story, and their stories intertwine back to the beginning of MEST.

    As spiritually aware beings we don’t need to fight people who think there is only MEST and that they are MEST, created from other MEST, which was created by other MEST…

    ….The information is already out that thought (theta) creates reality (MEST) and most people prefer to acknowledge themselves when they find this out, either by learning it from a book/film or from observing it in their own lives.

    We are all psychic, not just the ingo swanns of this world.

    Quick coment to Alanzo: this non-dualism you mention is also in scientology, and yes it is the “ultimate truth” from a high level that each of us is a Static.

    • 2009-11-03 at 18:49

      If you are a “thetan”, then you are part of a dualism.

      But if you disagree with Hubbard, and you see that there is actually no “war” at all between Theta and MEST, and that being MEST contains no liability whatsoever, then you are thinking in non-dualistic ways.

      You will also have no need to ridicule “materialists” like Richard Dawkins.

      And you will come to see that the “Brain Theory Boys” are not your enemy.

      And never have been.

      Alanzo

      • 2009-11-03 at 18:52

        Well, a stuck viewpoint like Richard Dawkins may not need redicule. A stuck viewpoint is still stuck, though.

        • 2009-11-03 at 19:03

          You are as OT as you can assume viewpoints.
          – L Ron Hoover

          • 2009-11-03 at 19:05

            Richard Dawkins not very OT then.

            • Chris
              2009-11-04 at 05:42

              No he’s not OT at all is he?
              The man has a button on disproving the old superstitions of the planet.My eval on him being crucified by his fellow Christians on the Whole Track was just sent up to your desk,sir 😉

              • 2009-11-04 at 10:46

                🙂

      • Hubbardianen
        2009-11-03 at 19:32

        I gotta agree that there is no reason to be at war with the brain/MEST guys. There are lots of interesting things that MEST-people come up with, such as Big Bang theory, physics, brainscientists etc.

        Yes, it’s true there’s a terrible overrepresentation of non-spiritual people among these people, but their materialism contribute to the facts about MEST.

        No reason to treat them as enemies. Most of them contribute.

      • As-Is
        2009-11-03 at 20:38

        A thetan is basically a static who is postulating and perceiving it’s postulates. Below this activity of postulating (creation) and perceiving (experiencing) are many levels of reality and truth about each level of reality, all created by the thetan and subscribed to by the thetan. But the thetan is ultimately still a static, no matter what it postulates and perceives. It can never really be hurt, but it’s created ideas about itself leave it vulnerable to feeling hurt.

        What I’ve written is in agreement with the fundamentals of the subject.

        • 2009-11-04 at 00:53

          And the fundamentals of the subject are basically dualistic.

          This is why Scientology is not a “cousin to Buddhism” at all.

          • As-Is
            2009-11-04 at 16:20

            Oh now I see the final point you wanted to make after all, the line of argument you wanted to lead to, the conclusion you wanted agreement on…

            Have your opinion on this by all means.

            But maybe also read the definition of a static, and then axiom 35.

  5. Jim Logan
    2009-11-03 at 16:21

    It seems Messr. Kant’s couldn’ts have had their surly bonds loosed broadly. Ahhh, sweet freedom. Thanks Geir.

  6. ExKane
    2009-11-03 at 18:42

    I don’t know that fear is the appropriate description.

  7. Maria
    2009-11-03 at 18:45

    It seems to me that once one steps beyond the two dimensional view, it is to a new range of “perceptions” that exist in that great beyond and a means of “understanding” that doesn’t follow the rules of two dimensions. Now this is fun!

  8. ExKane
    2009-11-03 at 18:58

    Many people report having these sort of perceptions and revelations on hallucinogens like LSD. See, for example, the artwork of Alex Grey (who does the art for my personal favorite band, Tool)

    http://www.cosm.org/10k.html

    • 2009-11-03 at 19:04

      Pretty well covered in Scientology tech on drugs.

      • ExKane
        2009-11-03 at 19:07

        What do you mean?

        • 2009-11-03 at 19:21

          LRH wrote about the reasons for revelations in relation to drugs.

          • ExKane
            2009-11-03 at 19:33

            Ah, Hubbard and drug use, including his own drug use. Perhaps another good topic? 😉

            • Anonymous
              2009-11-03 at 20:04

              I don’t think our friends, the Independent Scientologists, are ready for the revelations of ‘Ron the Drug Tripper’ quite just yet, or the revelation that Ron was not a Scientologist. That’s probably *way* further along the “learning curve.”

              The idea that during the 1950s and even the 1960s, Ron was, shall we say, “chemically assisted,” is just *too much*.

              • 2009-11-03 at 21:00

                Oh, the ad Hom. Yellow card to for your IP.

                I may ad there are accounts in both directions on this. I have seen accounts telling of drug abuse by LRH and I have talked to people who were even closer to him that contest that and say they saw no traces of such. Who knows. Speculations. Plus adHom and also off-topic for this thread.

              • Chris
                2009-11-04 at 05:44

                SHOW DOX OR GTFO.
                Ken Urquhart can verify over at PRO LRH TECH COMMUNITY MESSAGE BOARD that Ron DID NOT USE DRUGS on the research for Scientology.
                Unless you want to argue with Ron’s personal butler yourself 😉

              • 2009-11-04 at 10:48

                He was not only a butler – he held many posts, and he may very well have been the closest friend that LRH ever had aside from Mary Sue.

              • Chris
                2009-11-05 at 02:17

                The man is a hero in all sense of the word.
                The fact that he humbly remains for the most part quiet and just auditing and training is astounding.I had to glance at his column in IVY magazine and hear about him at the Freezone 2009 event to even be aware of his existence.
                Ken if you’re reading this,a salute!!!
                🙂

              • Soderqvist1
                2009-11-06 at 07:15

                Ken Urguhart has a home site, and a blog, Isene can’t you invite him too?
                http://www.urquhart-studio.com/ken_urquhart_scientology.html

              • 2009-11-06 at 07:45

                He is a moderator on the new forum.

            • 2009-11-03 at 20:11

              I know it!

              All these great topics are coming up!

              As soon as the doors to the new discussion forum open up, I’m gonna rush in and grab all the best seats! And then I’m going to hoard a whole bunch of topics!

              I’m gonna win!

              I *know* I’m gonna win!!!

              Alanzo

              • 2009-11-03 at 21:01

                And you have the ESMB stats to prove it.

              • Chris
                2009-11-04 at 05:46

                “I *know* I’m gonna win!!!”
                Slow down there tiger,this ain’t ESMB,this blog is vaguely sane and civilized here 🙂

            • Overdriver
              2009-11-03 at 20:33

              A couple of more comments like this getting through and I’ll abandon this blog… 🙂

              • 2009-11-03 at 21:05

                I am dealing yellow cards here. Next is red cards. Stay tuned 😉

  9. altruistichedonist
    2009-11-03 at 20:16

    Thanks Geir.

    For me, people have the choice to live in the illusion of limitation or to be outside of the illusion.
    For me, it is pointless to pontificate what lies outside of the illusion while in the illusion.
    For me, I will acknowledge that, while in the Church of Scientology, learning LRH’s works helped me to think outside the illusion. So did LSD. For now, I do not advocate either.
    For me, Fear of the unknown inhibits action. Curiosity to make known the unknown can result in freedom from fear. So I’ll continue to seek seek the opposite of fear and remain curious.

    • RJ
      2009-11-03 at 21:52

      Interesting point. I always viewed the sudden paradigm shift that occurred in the ’60’s caused by two factors LSD and Scientology, both efforts to expand one’s mind or increase one’s perception.

      Personally I found Scientology the most effective way of doing this. Back when I got into Scientology it was more theta oriented. Now it has become more MEST oriented partly because of Miscavige’s efforts to make the religion or philosophy more “main stream”(and we can all see how well that went!) which included the effort to promote the subject to the rich and the upper middle class who just happened to be the more conservative because they have a vested interest in keeping things the same (see the HCOB More on PTS) and this fixation on extravagance, i.e. these so called “Ideal Orgs” and these “Triumph of the Will” events.

      Another thing is that the organization has totally concentrated on auditing or counseling probably because of the big bucks involved and likely it is easier to control its members if they remain ignorant of the subject, since anything they do can be claimed as “on policy” or “Standard Tech” and the laity wouldn’t know any better. Also the emphasis now has switched from helping others by auditing to a fixation on “getting up the bridge”, meaning exclusively the right hand side of the bridge or the processing side and I think because of this it has become just another one of these flashy narcissistic New Age cults.

  10. Rafael
    2009-11-03 at 22:34

    Nice piece, people in the church are allowing DM to push them into a flat world, just the opposite direction of Scientology.

    • 2009-11-03 at 22:44

      It’s called “squeezing the public”.

  11. Rafael
    2009-11-04 at 00:36

    isene :It’s called “squeezing the public”.

    Ha! Ha! Ha ! couldn´t stop laughing with that picture !

    isene :It’s called “squeezing the public”.

  12. Martin
    2009-11-04 at 01:14

    I figure its time for me to say something that sounds batshit crazy, but as far as I can work it out, and its only verified by “what” is happening, not really “how” or “why”. “What” as was used in finding the dynamic principle of existence. What is happening? OT’s and scientologists are at war, players of comparable magnitude make a good game. The mark of criminals is mysteries (“where is that gold necklace”, answer, stolen etc). Scientologists have the same goal, we have different targets 1)Scntlgsts in the church are following LRH (albeit at the will of a madman DM) 2)Scntlgsts in the field are following LRH, trying to stop DM. The scntlgsts working for DM don’t know their enemy is composed of good people, falsely declared and trying to help.
    12 men run the banks, reserve banks, shadow govts, IRS, Church of spiritual technology.

    If, in the final analysis, the end-game is for these 12 men to divide and conquer scientologists and then run Black Dianetics on everyone, everywhere, even other galaxies etc, I figure we need to find out as much as possible right now.

    That was a summation of what I have seen. I cannot verify it. But it has given me a very strong purpose to find out exactly what the hell is going on. And the best attitude I can get on it is to continue on a path of helping.
    Not focus on being an “enemy” but focus on helping and doing what helps. Focusing on destruction inevitably recoils without having a further, higher goal, of eventually helping.

    Quotes from Ron from
    HCOB O-W a limited Theory. 22 Dec 1960
    “O-W can occur only when help has failed. Help is a co-joining of vectors of life.
    When two beings who have joined forces to help fail each other, only then does O-W
    come into existence.
    The forces of two beings cannot come into dispute until after they have first
    joined. Thus there is no war like that seen between brothers or husband and wife.”

    HCOB Assessment of Help,7 JULY 1960.
    “The action of help is not aberrative. The failure to help is what does it, or the lack of
    things to help.”

    Those are my thoughts at this time. I (really) hope they help.
    Any thoughts on it?

    • 2009-11-04 at 10:44

      If indeed DM is an SP, he must be taken out. I understand I am stating the obvious, but cooperation toward a common goal is not possible with one man acting as gatekeeper for everyone’s future.

      • Martin
        2009-11-04 at 11:23

        Yes, I agree completely. I may have misrepresented myself, I mean focus on help as well to stay out of the mire of destruction only.
        I cannot forsee any handling without his removal.
        My thoughts on him, explicitly:
        1) Remove him.
        2) Assess his level of psychosis
        3) Salvage whats left of him.

        My thoughts on the larger cycle:
        1) Remove him
        2) Unravel what happened
        3) Re-establish the original intention

        I was hoping to help anyone that had got too caught up in the overt/motivator activities and may have let the purpose to help self and others fall aside. The data was a successful action for me.
        Thankyou for what you are doing.

  13. Soderqvist1
    2009-11-04 at 06:31

    Alanzo :Only someone who believes in duality would have a hard time accepting that.
    Non-dualists find it very easy to accept.
    Actually, non-dualists find it very easy to accept anything.
    Have you ever heard of 4-Valued Logic and the 2nd century Buddhist philosopher named Nagarjuna? One finds that “Theta/MEST” theory is quite a dualism, and one needs more to rise up out of it.
    Non-dualism, as expressed in the concept of “emptiness”, and “no-self” by Nagarjuna leads the way.
    Here’s more: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nagarjuna#Philosophy
    It also works nicely with multi-dimensional Quantum and String theories.
    I have also found that it helps resolve the problem of mortality.

    Soderqvist1: “No-Self”?
    What does that mean “one needs more to rise up out of it” when there is no one there to rise up out of it? But it is consistent that say that; a self can easily rise out of the strange idea of no self!

    • 2009-11-05 at 01:04

      Looks like you and me are gonna hafta duke this one out on the new NatterBoard that Geir is setting up, Soderqvist1!!

      You just wait!!!

  14. Maria
    2009-11-04 at 13:32

    Major shifts of viewpoint in science are often met with resistance and ridicule due to preponderance of agreement in general and as an unfortunate consequence of peer-review. Dinosaurs as reptiles vs dinosaurs as birds, germ theory, flat world, Copernicus, relativity, etc.

    In 1920 Yogananda Paramhansa brought eastern spiritual teachings to the U.S. He established the Self Realization Fellowship, which spread like wildfire across the U.S. spearheading the spiritualist movement of the 1920 and 30s. One of his popular books was Yoga: the Science of Meditation.

    Yogananda’s message was simple: “The more one develops spiritually, the deeper becomes his or her love and compassion for humanity. Accompanying love and compassion is the desire to uplift humanity from the throes of ignorance and war and the consequent suffering they bring.”

    Scn began to carry this message in 1953. Oddly enough, the big blue buildings of Scn (the PAC base) moved into the same city block as the Self Realization Temple and Ashram established in 1942 at the corner of Edgemont and Sunset Blvd. in L.A.

  15. Anonymous
    2009-11-04 at 14:28

    Chris :SHOW DOX OR GTFO.Ken Urquhart can verify over at PRO LRH TECH COMMUNITY MESSAGE BOARD that Ron DID NOT USE DRUGS on the research for Scientology.Unless you want to argue with Ron’s personal butler yourself

    That is off-topic for this thread, and since it’s viewed as an attack (which it is not) on Ron, is *likely* not a welcome topic at any time, (and that is my opinion).

    [The rest is removed due to no DOX, much speculation, another adHom on Ken Urqhart – and as the poster self says, it is off-topic. Move to general section, pleeease. Before that, take a week’s break]]

    • Chris
      2009-11-05 at 01:54

      Pwnt.

  16. Anonymous
    2009-11-04 at 16:03

    Anonymous :

    Chris :SHOW DOX OR GTFO.Ken Urquhart can verify over at PRO LRH TECH COMMUNITY MESSAGE BOARD that Ron DID NOT USE DRUGS on the research for Scientology.Unless you want to argue with Ron’s personal butler yourself

    That is off-topic for this thread, and since it’s viewed as an attack (which it is not) on Ron, is *likely* not a welcome topic at any time, (and that is my opinion).
    [The rest is removed due to no DOX, much speculation, another adHom on Ken Urqhart – and as the poster self says, it is off-topic. Move to general section, pleeease. Before that, take a week’s break]]

    DOX *were* provided in the form of references as to where to go to look, for those interested. It was not necessary to delete those references.

    Bye.

    • 2009-11-04 at 16:51

      No real references given, just vague pointers – no links. And yes, bye.

      • Chris
        2009-11-05 at 02:14

        Double pwnt.
        Query here,do you hand out IP bans or just account ones?

        • 2009-11-05 at 10:13

          It depends. On my whimsically me.

  17. Maria
    2009-11-04 at 16:37

    I find this whole thread extraordinary. Geir posts a topic that is fascinating. It is immediately hijacked onto ad hom and venomous attacks on DM, Dn, Scn and LRH. Is that all you think about, want to talk about? This is freedom of thought?

    IMO, you need to widen your viewpoint a little. There are REAL bad guys working very hard on figuring out how to shut you up and manipulate you without you even being aware of it. Read up on MKULTRA on wikipedia. Also read this article: finder.org/site/more/electronic_mind_control/

    Maybe you don’t take any of this seriously, maybe you think this is all just a pile of malarkey, but the CIA certainly takes it seriously, seriously enough to maintain classified status on most of the information on this subject. Maybe you should too.

    The real crime would be to take technologies capable of undoing MKULTRA type activities out of the hands of individuals forever. You may not like the C of S, but it may be one of the few organizations in the world standing between you and total control. The more I follow this blog, the more I think Geir is right. The only answer is pushing all of that information and technology out on all lines possible so it can never be lost and ensuring that the C of S gets back on track 100%.

    Sorry this is so long and sorry about the rant, and sorry if I offended anyone but thinking freely is thinking freely not ranting and raving about the same things over and over and over ad nauseum.

    • 2009-11-04 at 16:53

      Quite OK. And I do apologize for not cracking down on the adHom and off-topic earlier.

    • Overdriver
      2009-11-04 at 17:28

      Indeed, a really great video.
      And those who think only about attacking LRH SCN and DM, are stucked in the 2D world.
      Besides, who knows who controls the Church now…

  18. Panther
    2009-11-05 at 10:16

    Damn! I thought I was quite bright until I started hanging around all you learned people! But actually it gives great encouragement that the momentous challenges being faced right now are being confronted by people of more than adequate sanity and intelligence to bring about sane solutions. Carry on!

  19. Nom de Plume
    2009-11-06 at 07:08

    Maybe my overts are at last making me go blind, but…

    I don’t see a link to a vid anywhere? 😦

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